SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Fourteen years ago today, my W revealed she'd been having sex with a client. She's OK now; she's still unhappy with herself, but I like and love her. I'm good. Our M is good. I can read JFO without triggering about being betrayed, although I do trigger on over-generalizations and what I think is bad thinking.

I get memories of d-day and being betrayed when I'm under stress sometimes, but I think that's mainly because I'm on SI almost every day; if I didn't continue to read and post, the A would have even less impact on me than it does now. I check myself periodically to see if I'm dodging personal issues, and the ones I'm dodging are always about myself now, not about my W or our M.

The A is firmly in my past. The memories are generally annoyances, except when I use a memory in posting here. We talked about the A this morning, as we do a few times a year. I'm sad about it, but not enough to brood; we quickly and naturally moved on to something a lot more pleasant. The A is just one part of our history, a significant part, to be sure, but not the biggest by any means.

I'm not sure why I'm still on SI, and I would not be surprised if I'm here because I'm still working on something. OTHO, I may be here as a way of contemplating our inhumanity to each other and how to recover from this one way we hurt.

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A Way to Read SI

I think we all have a few cohorts on SI.

One is the group of people with d-days 2-many years earlier than yours. We're good sources for the variations in healing. We demonstrate the variation in what might be in your future. We range from happy in R to happy in D to unhappy.

A 2nd is the group with d-days close to yours. They're good at giving you the variation of thoughts and feelings that are normal for someone in your position.

If you stick around, you'll see a 3rd group of people - those whose d-days came after yours. You'll be able to give them the help you once sought.

A 2nd way to Read SI

Some people tell you to do one thing or another. Others will post with a goal of helping you figure out your best best course of action.

You have to live your own life, and you know your sitch better than anyone here does. My reco is to place more weight on the counsel aimed at helping you figure out your best course of action.

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Healing part 1

My W's A was traumatic for this BS. My advice to BSes is to figure out what you want, then figure out how likely you think you can get what you want with your WS.

IMO, d-day makes it necessary for every BS and WS to figure out who you are, who you want to be, and how you'll change from who you are to who you want to be.

I think another and better way of putting that is: to heal, a BS needs to question themself, their images of life, their wants, their needs, their perceptions, their thinking, how they process their feelings - everything about themselves.

I'd focus on one's 'shoulds'. What 'shoulds' reflect one's real 'wants', and what lies underneath turning a want into a should? 'What 'shoulds' reflect what one has been told to want. What 'wants' are 'requirements? Which ones are 'nice to haves'? Which apply to oneself? Which apply to others?' Which are attainable? Which aren't? Which conflict with each other?

IOW, even though the WS has traumatized the BS, IMO it's best for the BS to take the blow and prepare to take their whole life apart and put it back together.

The BS doesn't necessarily need to change for the Ws; the change is necessary, IM, because the WS's A means the BS's image of reality needs at least some adjustment.

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Healing part 2

A second aspect of healing is, IMO, processing the feelings - mainly anger, grief, fear, and shame - that come with being betrayed.

We can all do difficult things even when we're experiencing strong feelings. It's natural to freeze, run, or attack another when attacked oneself. It's also pretty common to think before acting. Many of us have wanted to beat the shit out of our WSes or their aps, but not many of us have actually done it, for example. We can think even under the influence of strong feelings.

We have our feelings, after all; they don't have us.

But healing requires acknowledging, accepting, and releasing the feelings that come with being betrayed. The alternative is stuffing the feelings into one's body where they will fester and cause additional pain.

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Healing part 3

IMO, you'll do better if you open yourself up to both D and R. In some cases, the BS has no choice - for example, when the WS leaves or when the BS simply doesn't want the WS back. In most cases, however, both D & R are possibilities.

Some BSes decide to put one or the other off the table. My reco is to put preconceptions aside. Put aside your perception of society's desires. Focus on your healing and your best interests. Let the D/R decision flow from those considerations.

I say that because, IMO, every sitch has its own uniqueness, and you can't know what's best for you until you're in the sitch that requires you to decide.

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A Speculation

I wonder how many of us - BSes and WSes alike - are driven by fear of abandonment.

Fearing abandonment was a part of my life for a looong time. I resolved it 10-15 years before my W's A, and IMO doing so helped me understand the A was about her, not about me. Pre-resolution, I saw myself as a person who might deserve being left. Post-resolution, I saw myself as a good guy and good H who people would not want to leave. My confidence made it easier for my W to gaslight me during her A, but it made it harder to gaslight me after d-day.

IMO, fear of abandonment can show up in WSes who are motivated to cheat, at least in part, by cheating because the fear they will be dumped or cheated on. It may be visible in BSes who won't or can't see D as a possible resolution in their unique cases.

But fear is a lousy way to decide. My reco is to, instead, choose the option that you think will bring you the most joy, even though that looks riskier than deciding based on your fear of more pain.

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Something that helped me and still does

Like many BSes, I often spiraled into circular thinking about how hard life is for a BS. Psychology calls it 'perseveration.'

Almost always, the way out was first to ask myself, 'What am I feeling?' and then to decide how to express myself. Sometimes I'd raise an issue with my W; sometimes, scream, sometimes, write; sometimes, take a walk or a drive, etc., etc., etc.

But the way out of the downward spiral started with knowing what I was feeling. At first, it was often difficult to know that. Keeping it simple - limiting my answers to one of mad/sad/scared, or ashamed - helped a lot.

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A Note on My Wording

I write 'd-day' instead of 'D-Day' because I grew up with men who landed in Normandy on D-Day. As traumatic as d-day was, I'm glad I was far from those beaches on June 6, 1944. IMO, there's no comparison.

I do not use upper case letters to refer to om, ow, ap, etc. Upper case letters imply respect that they don't deserve.

I redesign sentences to avoid using any of those terms as the 1st letter of a sentence.

I hope everyone would follow my example in this.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 8:57 PM, Sunday, December 22nd]

Thank you...some great insight and thoughts...appreciate it.

Great post sisoon. You are a huge asset to this community.

I’m back on SI now and am 10 years out from dday 2. I’m struggling hard and I don’t really know how to get past it this time. I’m back in therapy, started two weeks ago. My H stopped wanting to discuss anything affair related a few years ago but says he’s willing to do MC again. Says he’s been waiting for me to figure this out for myself. He has a toxic amount of shame (my opinion) and I still have shame too about being cheated on and fooled for so long. And I’m hyper fixated on the cruelty of the whole situation. No one really knows except our parents so I don’t have anyone to talk to. I stopped trusting anyone on dday 1. I have no friends. I’ve done that to myself out of fear.

Any advice on what else I should be doing to help myself move on/ feel better/ release all of this trauma? Maybe I’m just pain shopping.

Thank you for sharing. I know when I first came to SI last year it was very overwhelming and surreal to have to utilize an infidelity related site. I’m so thankful to have found it and I am so grateful for posters like you who have remained a contributing member for so many years. There are probably about a dozen members here that I have gotten to "know" and because of that I look forward to such responses and advice … you sir are one of them. Stories like yours gives me hope that a person can come out better on the other side, regardless of the outcome.

[This message edited by Heartbrokenwife23 at 3:08 AM, Monday, December 23rd]

I'm not sure why I'm still on SI, and I would not be surprised if I'm here because I'm still working on something.

😊😊😊

You are a great asset to SI - a calm presence holding space, asking good questions or gently recommending (is ‘reco’ an Americanisation btw?) another way or an alternative look at something, a pause for reflection, offering a reframe or whatever. Thanks for all your work, Sisoon.

Threadjack @mlav69

i have no friends. I’ve done that to myself out of fear.

Any advice on what else I should be doing to help myself move on/ feel better/ release all of this trauma? Maybe I’m just pain shopping.

Feel the fear and do it anyway. We all need to connect and belong. What is it about friends/ people you are afraid of? Please seek to trust yourself, and the rest will follow.

Perhaps read some Claire Weekes. You can be kind to your nervous system by doing grounding work etc but you also have to teach it that it’s ok by doing things you fear and by doing both in conjunction thereby increase your bandwidth/ window of tolerance.

Apologies for threadjack.

[This message edited by Edie at 10:45 AM, Monday, December 23rd]

The BS doesn't necessarily need to change for the Ws; the change is necessary, IM, because the WS's A means the BS's image of reality needs at least some adjustment.

Wise

Heck, I’d say most of humanity could take that advice. 😉

I guess my triage-training is kicking in, because I’m going to start by addressing mlav69 before I get to the going-to-survive-and-is-actually-thriving GrandMaster Sisoon...

mlav69
Start a new thread with a title like "how to grow socially" or "how to expand my social life" or "how to get out of fear" and I’m 100% certain you will get help.

sisoon

I agree with about everything you say.
But I might have a hard time with the upper-case thing... Willing to try though.

On the D-day issue... I so get it. For a long time, I have hated the indirect connection/reference to one of the most important day of recent history to this foul day that discovering infidelity is. I have thought of suggesting we call it TDMWC-day, but that’s not catchy (The Day My World Collapsed-day...). I guess I can try to remember to use lowercase d-day...

ps... You tend to write sisoon with a lower-case s, so I'm doing that in this post. In not using a capital S I am definitely not showing you disrespect, but rather respect in following your example.

ps... You tend to write sisoon with a lower-case s, so I'm doing that in this post. In not using a capital S I am definitely not showing you disrespect, but rather respect in following your example.

This just made me cry. I love the respect shown and then the courtesy to make sure the intent is clear. Bigger, sisoon, you are both amazing men. I’m deeply grateful for both of you, both put significant imprints on my life journey.

Thank you for posting this. Like many I read a lot but don't post much. I hope you continue to post your insights. I always look for them.

I type d-day, ap, etc. in lower case by choice. I write my id in lower case because I'm a hunt-and-peck typist and avoiding keystrokes helps reduce my typing error count. Seriously.

OTOH, my education is somewhat classical; I satisfied my college language requirement with Latin. I was trained to write in complete sentences with proper punctuation, etc., etc., etc. That requires me to make many keystrokes that more modern people avoid.

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When I came to SI, I wasn't respecting myself. I hit enter on my registration before thinking about capitalizing my name - hence, 'sisoon.'

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Fellow members of SI have gotten me through some excruciatingly difficult times. Edie, I think you know you helped a lot. I'd like to list others, but my memory isn't working just now.

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Boy, mlav, you're not alone. I, too, urge you to start a thread.

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Thanks for the kind words.

Great post Sisoon.

I understand you questioning why you’re still here on SI, but I am grateful you have stuck around.

Your reasonable, thoughtful responses kept me here in my darkest days after discovery. I know I have thanked you a few times, but words don’t quite do justice for my deep appreciation for your help and SI’s help on my healing journey.

I do understand why healed people (R or D) move on from this community. I also find my only hardcore reminders of my pain are here, in the same place that helped me so much.

I’m also finding that the longer I’m healed, the less helpful I am to the newly betrayed. I tend to want people to be as healed as I am, and it doesn’t work that way. Ultimately, with or without kind words from members here, we each have to be our own hero, and pull ourselves out of the very unique Hell of infidelity.

My wife and I have lined up a number of trips for next year, and whatever breaks I usually take from the ‘net will be a lot longer. I do still like trying to pay it forward, even if I’m missing the mark more often than not these days. So, I imagine I’ll still check in when I can.

As for healing, I have learned a few things. Resentment really is drinking poison and hoping the other person dies — it’s more than a bumper sticker. I also found that focusing on blame (in any relationship) doesn’t fix a thing. Infidelity is 100 percent on the person who chose to do it. Pretty clear where the source for infidelity pain comes from, it’s how I decided to tackle the adversity that made the difference for me. Horrible stuff happens to folks everyday, and we’re built to adapt and overcome trauma. Of course, it can take years for us to do just that, but most of us get there, regardless of the path we choose forward.

Best point that I loved about your post, never stay out of fear. That’s asking to lean into future resentments.

Since I was abandoned by my biological father, I was already a veteran of abandonment issues. If anything, that experience helped me to understand I don’t require validation from anyone. Validation, for me, is only a luxury in a healthy relationship, and shouldn’t be the primary need for any of us. Self-love gets overused all the time, yet, without it, we’re in trouble.

Knowing I am awesome with or without my M was the key to my R.

We built back because we wanted to see what our M would look like with the best version of each of us — and truly wanting the best for each other.

@sisoon I don't know that it makes any difference, but your contributions to SI have been sooooo helpful to me. We have very different stories, but the compassion and wisdom you share have always made me happy to read your posts. You are always so kind, welcoming, and gentle to the new folks. You are a big part of the reason I found SI so helpful and healing for me.

I know it's hard to keep coming here and sharing your wisdom. As someone who isn't new but isn't old (almost 2 years out), your words still have so much meaning for me. I hope you keep it up!

OTOH, my education is somewhat classical; I satisfied my college language requirement with Latin. I was trained to write in complete sentences with proper punctuation, etc., etc., etc. That requires me to make many keystrokes that more modern people avoid.

We have that in common! I took Latin in both high school and college, and then went to law school, so it only got worse.

Beautiful post, sisoon. You are always so thoughtful, and I respect and appreciate your contributions here.

I'm one of those who arrived here many years after the fact. I realize now that what I had called "acceptance" was really just rug sweeping. You can't accept things that you never really faced.

I wonder how many of us - BSes and WSes alike - are driven by fear of abandonment.

This was one of the most important things I have come to understand in trying to finally figure things out. I never wanted to think of myself as having childhood trauma - it seemed too dramatic for what I thought was a pretty ordinary childhood. But I learned as a child that people who love you can leave and that terrified me.

So I created this fantasy of "true love" where you could trust someone completely because they would never do that to you. That made me an easy victim, first of the affair and then of blame shifting and gas lighting. All under the supervision of our "shared responsibility" school IC/MC.

Even though I recognized that was a delusion in the wake of her A, I see now that in many ways I still clung to that thinking post A. I made as many excuses for her in my mind as she made for herself. I was prone to blaming myself even without her help. I understand now that was a trauma response.

When you're in the thick of it and battling every day to extract just an ounce of truth and everyone else is telling you that you don't need to know that - you don't *want* to know that - it is really easy to give in to the delusions and self blame. You're exhausted and you just want your old life back. And that's what they're offering. Just forget about this and things can go back to the way they were.

But that's not what you get. What you get is living a lie where you are the patsy.

If you want to heal and forgive I think you have to insist on absolute transparency and having all your questions answered. True remorse is essential to a safe relationship going forward and if they have achieved that then they should be ready to stop protecting themselves to avoid the truth. You can decide how much detail you want but I would advise having them write out every detail in case you have more questions later when they could plausibly say they don't remember.

Do not accept any blame. No marriage is perfect and as soon as you entertain the notion that problems in the marriage were the cause of the A you've lost all hope. If your partner is unhappy then their responsibility is to talk with you about it. If they're not happy with the outcome (which doesn't mean they're right) their options are IC, MC, and divorce.