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Newest Member: ConstantlyConfused

General :
How does one stop feeling owed?

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 Miserylikescompany (original poster member #83993) posted at 2:28 PM on Friday, February 2nd, 2024

Every book I've read (and they are many), whether on recovering from infidelity or forgiveness of unforgivable things in general, as well as all the wise long timers here on SI mention the fact that at some point in your recovery journey, you make a choice of sorts. To stop needing or wanting what you are in fact owed, because the scales can never be levelled anyways, or because your WW has given you as much as they are capable of, and mainly so that you can free yourself. I understand this, and I want it, deeply. For me. Not to let my WW off the hook or tu rug sweep. But to start feeling better, for ME.

But I find myself stuck here. I'm stuck punishing my WW with words and being petty and difficult in all aspects of life non A-related, I'm stuck feeling like he owes me. I KNOW, intellectually, that I must heal me even though my WW was the one that broke me. Emotionally, to get to that acceptance is hard. I still feel so deeply that it's his mess, he needs to fix it. I know that there is nothing more my WW can really do to help me out of this particular rut in my R journey. This is a me-issue. And I know what I want and need to get to. It's the HOW I'm struggling with.

So what types of thoughts, insights etc helped you get over that hump? What was it that finally let you stop punishing, stop feeling owed, letting go of that being owed, starting on a new slate, levelling your WW up to your level again, whatever it is you want to call it. Stop bringing up the A in every single small thing where your WW is being selfish in any way and just really hurting yourself more than the WW in the end. Because I do realise that's what's happening here, I'm hurting myself the most.
Am I pissing him off? hell yes, and I'm driving him to his wits end, and sabotaging our recovery and hurting him. Those parts I feel I'm pretty much justified in doing I guess, but are they helping me? no. They are hurting me as well so I really want to stop but I can't seem to find that switch in my heart and mind. I'm so humiliated and angry and hurt and my way of getting that out is rather toxic it seems. So I'm really looking for advice on what made that switch turn for you? what made you realise it was time, you were ready, or if it never happened that way, what things did you actively try to change in yourself to allow it to happen? This is a change I want for myself no matter if we succeed in R or go for D. I just don't like being this person.

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dontlookbackinanger ( new member #82406) posted at 2:55 PM on Friday, February 2nd, 2024

Wish I could offer something constructive, but all I can say is I feel like I'm in the EXACT same boat with my WW wife. Would love to hear insights.

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SacredSoul33 ( member #83038) posted at 3:34 PM on Friday, February 2nd, 2024

This is a really good question and an important topic.

IMO, you're still kind of early for letting go of feeling owed. You are owed. You're owed a lot. But you do need to figure out a way to express your feelings in a healthy manner.

The first thing I think would help is having a conversation with your WH in a quiet moment and telling him that you're very angry and hurt and sometimes that's really, really hard to regulate. Apologize for being ugly. Assert that these feelings are a normal response, but own that you need to learn to handle them differently. (I kicked a hole in the wall when I was at your stage of recovery. I get it.)

Then practice with "I feel" statements. If you feel anger bubbling up and can catch it before it blows, say something like "Look, I'm feeling really mad right now and I'm trying so hard not to be ugly to you." If you can't stop yourself before you spew rage, stop it as soon as you can and, even if you have to scream it, say "I'm sorry! I feel so angry and hurt and disgusted!" Or whatever you're feeling. Always apologize for being ugly. For you. You need that. Do NOT apologize for your feelings, only for your actions.

A couple of things that helped me get the anger out:

I beat the hell out of my couch with a pillow in a kind of layman's version of bataka therapy. You can use a Nerf bat or something else that won't cause damage, and go to town. There's a specific way to do it: Hold the pillow/bat with both hands. Swing it over your head so that it's touching your back. Give it all you got and hit the couch/bed as hard as you can. While you're swinging, SCREAM. From your gut. LOUDLY. Put your whole rage into it. If you yell a sentence, do it one word at a time and swing hard with each word. Do it until you don't feel like doing it anymore. It'll wear you out. Do NOT do this in front of children or animals. It will freak them out.

I also did a lot of driving around and listening to angry music. "Break Stuff" was my go-to song and I played it on a loop, screaming along. I'd roll down the windows and let my hair be wild and get primal. This is a good escape when you feel like you're about to blow up on your H.

I had SI friends who swore by throwing ice in the shower. Some people throw axes or break plates. Some journal. Some journal and burn it. Some go to the batting cage. Some start boxing or playing roller derby so they can hit other people. grin

Remove the "I want you to like me" sticker from your forehead and place it on the mirror, where it belongs. ~ Susan Jeffers

Your nervous system will always choose a familiar hell over an unfamiliar heaven.

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5Decades ( member #83504) posted at 6:04 PM on Friday, February 2nd, 2024

I’m going to talk about this coming from my life as a child from a household with severe physical and psychological abuse.

Trigger warning for those who need to skip this. I will not provide details here. It’s relevant only because of how I moved forward without ever getting any restitution, justice, or an apology.

My father was unpredictable. We never knew if he would be the nice dad or the mean dad from moment to moment, nor what might be the thing that would set him off. There was no way to know, either. He might not hurt you for sitting down today, but he did yesterday, and might tomorrow. Then again, he might do the same for standing up, too.

He would blame me for things I never did. Or things I did "wrong". Or things that never happened. He would twist the truth one way, then the next day change it so it fit his new story. Gaslighting was his specialty. My world wasn’t stable, only I knew it, and somehow managed to maintain my sense of sanity despite his attacks on my being. My brothers didn’t mentally survive this, and both are psychologically unstable still.

So living a life being blindsided was a thing I did. I grew up that way.

When I got married, I never expected my husband would blindside me with his cheating. Early in the marriage, we had a great deal of difficultly, separated, reconciled, but then we were very stable for about 30 years. Solid marriage, and he had a PA. I realize now that we rugswept at the time in 2005 (he had a cancer diagnosis about three weeks after DDay which definitely changed the trajectory of that recovery). Now, 18 years later, he has an online EA and we are in recovery again. This time we are doing this right - no rugsweeping.

But your question is "how do I stop feeling owed?"

I used to feel a lot of anger at my father. At everyone, really. Why didn’t anyone do anything to stop it all? Why didn’t HE STOP?

I held that anger close to me. It had a kind of value, you know, like a very powerful weapon I could unleash at any moment. It was almost a superpower.

That anger could win arguments. But….did I "win", really, or did I just overpower someone into acquiescence and have them just start believing I was…..more like my father?

I felt owed. I was owed an apology. I was owed a decent childhood. I was owed back the self-confidence he ripped from me. I was owed more than I could put words to.

It was during a fight with my husband a very long time ago that I came to understand what I was doing with that feeling, and that anger. WH looked at me and said, "You know, I am arguing with you about the laundry right now. YOU are arguing about something completely different, because NOBODY can be that angry about laundry."

He was right. I knew exactly what I was arguing about.

WH asked me to get help, and I did.

So, that’s the context. The part I learned that kind of answers your question is this:


I describe my anger over the abuse as being a very large cauldron of boiling lava. I kept it ready, always on the fire, always on the front burner. Hot and bubbling.

Any time anything made me mad, no matter how small, I dipped into that cauldron and got myself a nice scoop of lava. It served up well. It was an endless source, ready to rumble. Nevermind that it had absolutely no relevance to the issue at hand! It was a great power, and that anger was hot on fire and super powerful, and worked for all sources of irritation in life.

Only it didn’t really "work".

It stopped people from bothering me, sure. It shut them down, yes.

But it never really solved my problems. In fact, it usually made matters worse, led to volatile relationships with a boyfriend, and made what would ordinarily be unremarkable exchanges into heated arguments.

I realized I used that pot of lava for everything that bothered me. Big or small. I went to it instantly, at the first sign of distress, disagreement, or even when I thought someone might be thinking about not agreeing with me.

I was serving up anger, and it wasn’t serving me well.

Once I saw this, I realized that the source of the anger was in part my inability to release myself from this clanging shout in my head "UNFAIR, THE INJUSTICE, WHY! WHY ME?" and all of that. I had to let that go. It was in understanding that there was no restitution coming. It could not be undone. There was no apology that would magically make the pain evaporate, the self-esteem return, the years re-run, or the childhood memories become better.

And that if I was choosing - yes, CHOOSING - to act out in anger and hatred, then I was also choosing to take a path of darkness in my life. I was choosing that cauldron to BOIL MYSELF IN. By choice.

So I chose to walk away from the stove.

It has made all the difference. At first, it was a conscious choice to stop myself. It got easier each time. Now, it is who I am. Calm, cool under pressure.

I am not my father.


When it comes to wanting restitution justice for the affairs? I know I cannot ever get that. It cannot be given. There is a brokenness in me around the infidelity that will not be healed, and when I look at my husband, there is also a brokenness in him that match my wounds. We know this, now. Together, we’re planning to take our lessons and build a new marriage. Our time left is short, but we’re working fast.

5Decades BW 68 WH 73 Married since 1975

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sisoon ( Moderator #31240) posted at 6:20 PM on Friday, February 2nd, 2024

Question. You write 'WW". That usually means 'wayward wife', but you talk about your WS (wayward spouse) as 'he'; normally I'd expect to see either 'WS or 'WH' (wayward husband) from you. What does 'WW' mean as you use it? (I'm asking for clarification, not criticizing.)

Hmm...does your 'WW' mean 'wayward wasband'?

*****

I agree that it's a little early for you to stop.

*****

Look, no matter whether you D or R, you have to accept that your WS simply won't hurt the way you do, whether you D or R, and that's a typical wish.

You've got to accept that you can't hurt your WS without adding to your own pain.

You've got to admit that there's no way to restore what was taken from you.

There's a lot of anger, grief, fear, and even shame in all of that, and it takes, usually, more than a year to process that pain out of your body. So you may be healing more than you realize.

*****

A little more on 'I feel...' statements, as I learned from several bouts of therapy.

You've got to use feeling words - anger, grief, fear, shame, desire, love ....

'I'm furious that you cheated' is a lot more effective at releasing anger than 'You're not worth the air you breathe'.

Besides, the 1st is about you, and if your WS wants to R, they can either be supportive or realize they are responsible for the action your angry about. The 2nd way of expressing anger evokes defensiveness.

I'm not saying an 'I' statement will evoke the response you want. If it doesn't, it's a sign your WS may not be a good candidate for R.

And when making an 'I feel...' statement, use your emotion. An angry statement that you're angry is likely to be a lot more effective if anger is in your voice than if your voice is flat, unless your point is to show growing indifference....

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

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SacredSoul33 ( member #83038) posted at 8:10 PM on Friday, February 2nd, 2024

A little more on 'I feel...' statements, as I learned from several bouts of therapy.

You've got to use feeling words - anger, grief, fear, shame, desire, love ....

'I'm furious that you cheated' is a lot more effective at releasing anger than 'You're not worth the air you breathe'.

Besides, the 1st is about you, and if your WS wants to R, they can either be supportive or realize they are responsible for the action your angry about. The 2nd way of expressing anger evokes defensiveness.

I'm not saying an 'I' statement will evoke the response you want. If it doesn't, it's a sign your WS may not be a good candidate for R.

This is a very, very important clarification. Use a feelings list if you need to to nail down the emotion that fits. (They're all over Google.) I'm betting that you've learned this in therapy already, but putting it into regular practice is powerful stuff.

When you _____, I feel _____. Practice it until it's second nature. smile

Remove the "I want you to like me" sticker from your forehead and place it on the mirror, where it belongs. ~ Susan Jeffers

Your nervous system will always choose a familiar hell over an unfamiliar heaven.

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Abcd89 ( member #82960) posted at 8:21 PM on Friday, February 2nd, 2024

I upped my meditation. I have done yoga and meditation on and off since I was a teenager. I increased the amount by a lot! I focus on my breathe.

5Decades your post really resonates with me. I am the same. I too have a little cauldron of anger simmering. My childhood was lovely in the main. My parents were the best (lots of flaws but well meaning, good, honest people). But I had been adopted early in life, I suffered sexual assaults as a teenager (not family) and had a very physically abusive boyfriend as a teen and this took its toll. I was always resilient and strong and self reliant. I am a fighter. But I have an undercurrent of anger which I fight with.

I am angry at my spouse due to losing a safe, secure, loving marriage I REALLY needed that. I really, really needed that. I would never have settled for anyone - I wasn’t bothered about marriage. I was angry that I wouldn’t have chosen to marry him. I feel tricked and that really sucked.

Miserylikescompany - why do you feel humiliated? That jumped out at me. Can you explore that?

It jumped out, as although we are all very different of course, I don’t feel humiliated. This is his mess, his poor choices, his weaknesses, his issues. I was in the same marriage, I have had challenges in life but I stayed faithful DESPITE the challenges. I feel good about myself. I feel sorry for him that he thought this would be a good choice. That he needed external validation due to poor coping mechanisms. Eek it’s humiliating but for him - not me. Imagine choosing to do things that damage a marriage you apparently want.

I am doing my best to honor MYSELF in a storm of shit that he created in order to collect kibbles. Can you reframe your thoughts on humiliation? Shame is a huge emotion - have you read Brene Brown?

I have worked on forgiveness but that focus was only on me. I am my priority and I totally forgive me. I don’t forgive him. I have forgiven myself for not forgiving him and I’m okay with that. He’s not so happy about it but honesty is important to me - so I told him anyway. laugh

To be very specific - I forgive myself for not confronting him earlier but it proves, despite my issues, I learnt to trust the words of my spouse (hard for an adoptee).

I forgive myself for not kicking him out and divorcing him Immediately but it proves my words are meaningful as I promised my children I would do my best by them. And I’m doing that every day I try.

I forgive myself for crying and not being strong but that proves I have had a normal emotional reaction to this situation despite my background.

I can’t see why that is humiliating. I’m standing by my values - I am fighting for my values - because they matter to me.

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Abcd89 ( member #82960) posted at 8:48 PM on Friday, February 2nd, 2024

Forgiveness isn’t your specific question but it’s an example of reframing.

So Just to add - I don’t forgive him because he put my children’s security at risk. He took advantage of my trust. He lied and gaslit me. He chose to abuse me. I’m not sure I’ll ever forgive that. Why should I expect myself too?

I am adopted and I am very much as peace with this. I am pleased my birth parents relinquished me . It allowed me to have my parents, they gave me an amazing childhood and family - the best. I doubt I would have had a better childhood by not being adopted. I actually think I am pretty good at forgiveness.

I don’t forgive the sexual abuse or assault - but I am at peace as I didn’t deserve that and I forgive myself I guess. I could blame myself, wrong place, being trusting, not getting away, but I know no one deserves that’s to happen to them - it’s a disgrace on the perpetrator.

Cheating is abuse. I doubt I’ll forgive that. It’s a choice made to stab your loved one in the back deliberately and repeatedly while kissing them on the lips. I can’t forgive it. But why should I? It’s the worse trauma I’ve personally had in my life by a country mile.

[This message edited by Abcd89 at 8:49 PM, Friday, February 2nd]

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BraveSirRobin ( member #69242) posted at 10:17 PM on Friday, February 2nd, 2024

Question. You write 'WW". That usually means 'wayward wife', but you talk about your WS (wayward spouse) as 'he'; normally I'd expect to see either 'WS or 'WH' (wayward husband) from you. What does 'WW' mean as you use it? (I'm asking for clarification, not criticizing.)

I'm thinking it's WayWard.

WW/BW

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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 6:17 AM on Saturday, February 3rd, 2024

As soul sister said, its tooo early to call the debt paid.

I am sorry for your pain, I commend you that you are looking inward to seek your own healing.

It’s hard for you to envision the road ahead, and everywhere you have been before feels tainted or questionable. Seeking to rely on yourself during those times in trying to ease your own pain and self soothe tells me you are a very emotionally mature person.

Unfortunately, you are currently married to an emotionally immature person. What is he doing towards changing that? If he is actively pursuing his whys and how’s that’s a good start.

The debt will never fully be repaid. However, if he consistently over a long period of time proves his love and trustworthiness, it might result in you finding that point where you can give grace to fill the gap.

What you are describing is 100 percent normal. Your brain is trying to recoup from the trauma. It’s normal for the anger and grief to come out at the ws. And if he can’t handle it, then you should cease reconciling with him, either for good or until he is willing to humble himself and face the damage he has caused you.

7 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

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This0is0Fine ( member #72277) posted at 6:37 AM on Sunday, February 4th, 2024

That's the neat part, you don't, not completely. It's not a weapon to bludgeon your ws with, but there is no absolution.

Love is not a measure of capacity for pain you are willing to endure for your partner.

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InkHulk ( member #80400) posted at 3:30 PM on Sunday, February 4th, 2024

And if he can’t handle it, then you should cease reconciling with him, either for good or until he is willing to humble himself and face the damage he has caused you.

Wise words that I wish I had heeded a year ago. But I also see in myself that I just couldn’t at that time, my traumatized mind and heart weren’t in that place. Looks like you and I are on similar time scales. I believe you need to give yourself permission to feel everything you are feeling. Don’t hurt anyone or yourself, but feel it fully and accept that is just where you need to be for right now and you aren’t going to stay there for long. You don’t know how you will feel in a month or a year. We’re both still on the rollercoaster. But to get off it sometime in the (hopefully) not too distant future, I think we need to be honest with ourselves, feel our feels, and strive each day for a bit of healing. I hope for that for you.

People are more important than the relationships they are in.

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 Miserylikescompany (original poster member #83993) posted at 5:28 PM on Sunday, February 4th, 2024

Been off the forums a few days so here comes a LONG try at answering many of you at once:


I also did a lot of driving around and listening to angry music. "Break Stuff" was my go-to song and I played it on a loop, screaming along. I'd roll down the windows and let my hair be wild and get primal. This is a good escape when you feel like you're about to blow up on your H.

Olivia Rodgrigo's album and especially her songs Vampire (for screaming) and Logical (for ugly-crying)have been my go to's for "singing" in the car to get my rage and pain out.


I describe my anger over the abuse as being a very large cauldron of boiling lava. I kept it ready, always on the fire, always on the front burner. Hot and bubbling.

Trigger warning for this next paragraph on some pretty horrible childhood stuff: Yup this is me. I grew up in a hot HOT mess. Alcoholism, some drugs, violence, completely unstable parents unable to put us kids first, or second or even tenth due to their own struggles and traumas. We moved like 12 times before I was 7 and the parents were always in new volatile realtionships with alcohol and violence that we witnessed. We had to stop our father from beating our mum to death etc. You get the idea. So I've been in and out of therapy since I was 20 and on SSRI's for anxiety for almost 15 years due to childhood PTSD, and I'm the sibling that has done the best. Meaning I can keep a steady job down, I managed to finish university, I've been in a steady (until now) relationship for 20+ years, my kids are stable and doing well (but this past year has not been good at home, something I hate) etc. My brother on the other hand has had problems with alcohol and drugs since he was a teenager, he's been on a psych ward several times and attempted suicide multiple times due to the mess we grew up in.
So I feel owed. And I REALLY needed a stable marriage. A stable life. And I built one, we built one together, for 21 years. Until my WH imploded. I feel like screaming at the universe. 'Really?! Really?! Have I not been through enough?!'. We've buried parents together, we've been together since we were 20 years old. We had kids early and lost parents early and we have managed to pull through so much shit life threw at us together and then he goes and does THIS? So I'm mad as hell. I'm boiling over all the time, and have been I guess for years (there was this infamous incident where my WH looked at me like wtaf when I once lost it over him bringing home the wrong groceries many years back. 'This can not be about me buying the wrong meat? was his comment'. And no it wasn't. But since DD I am exploding all the time. It's like a lifetime of anguish and anger is coming out like a volcano, aimed at WH. I've had enough in life, I had no fight left in me, I needed safety and stability and then he did this to us. It just completely crushed me.

Hmm...does your 'WW' mean 'wayward wasband'?

laughed at this for a bit, he might be haha laugh . I just somehow forgot that WW isn't wayward but wayward wife when posting. Sorry about the confusion.

Look, no matter whether you D or R, you have to accept that your WS simply won't hurt the way you do, whether you D or R, and that's a typical wish.


Sounds about right. I do want him to suffer like I do, even though I KNOW that hurting him hurts me as well. Sigh. duh

why do you feel humiliated? That jumped out at me. Can you explore that?


I don't really know why? But I do, I feel utterly humiliated by having been cheated on. By having been made a fool of (f. ex. they chatted about how paranoid I was once I started asking him if he was cheating on me, and what a controlling wife he had that started checking his phone, poor him). I guess I feel that I was some how not worthy of being faithful to, that I wasn't good enough, the typical blows to one's self confidence that a lot of us struggle with after DD. Humiliated that I married someone who could do this, and could do this to me, to us. I put so much of my self worth on my "stable happy family" duh that I had managed to build out of the rubble that was my childhood. And then it's all blown to pieces like the marriage, and I, was worth nothing.


Unfortunately, you are currently married to an emotionally immature person. What is he doing towards changing that? If he is actively pursuing his whys and how’s that’s a good start.


Not a lot unfortunately. He was in IC for maybe 5 months after DD but stopped because his IC moved cities and he hasn't put the effort into finding a new one as he felt he'd already done some IC. he has started looking now after I reminded him it was one of my non-negotiable he truly dig into himself. He's read a few books, we're in MC, and the first maybe 8 months he was putting in a lot of effort to R, but at the moment I think he is pretty exhausted from all the fighting, as am I so he's started recoiling a bit into his shell (he's severely avoidant and has always been).

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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 6:43 PM on Sunday, February 4th, 2024

I think most ws are avoidant. I was so avoidant prior to my affair, I couldn’t even speak up and say where I wanted to eat.

It feels like you want to fix your vitriol so that it relieves him in some way. As if it’s a burden to him and it’s going to wreck the process. That’s also completely normal.

But, resist that. Again, I think it’s great you are looking at your own healing, but you can’t heal faster out of fear. (And to be honest ws can’t heal faster because of fear either) I would say both of you need to dig into finding compassion with yourselves.

It might sound confusing that I say the ws needs to find their compassion for themselves. After all, shouldn’t they feel off the charts horrible? Yes for some period that is helpful to precipitate the wheels of change in the beginning. Noone changes in comfort. But, later, it impedes progress. If he can’t find compassion for himself, he will let his shame send him back into his shell. That part isn’t your problem, I was merely explaining what happens.

For you, self compassion looks like "I need to honor what I feel, even if it’s uncomfortable for him". I would maybe dig at what you are afraid of and see if you can find a way to be comfortable with it. For most, it’s fear of divorce and the unknowns that come with that.

So I would recommend instead of putting hard work in suppressing or fixing your feelings, find a way to fix the fear. For us, it was drawing up the divorce agreement. And not really because we were getting a divorce right then but so that H could see what that would look like. Having financial plans, plans for the kids, etc, and knowing you will be okay no matter what happens can make you put that urgency to rest.

This IS exhausting and painful for both people. But, know there is richness that can come from this no matter how it works out. Focus on that rather than the outcome of the marriage. I know that seems impossible to imagine some days, but either you will come out of it with a spouse that has proven himself and helped restore your faith in marriage, or you will come out of it minus a spouse who doesn’t align with who you are or what you want - and one day you might find there to be opportunity to find that person instead. It’s just so distant right now as you sit sifting through the ashes. But keep taking the reign of who you are, what you want, be unwilling to settle for less and you will come out of it stronger and more in alignment with the life you want for yourself.

[This message edited by hikingout at 6:45 PM, Sunday, February 4th]

7 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

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5Decades ( member #83504) posted at 7:45 PM on Sunday, February 4th, 2024

Misery,

We moved many times, too. One of my brothers was hospitalized twice for suicide attempts and has been on disability ever since. My other brother was discharged from the service for mental health reasons, and is also still struggling. My sister has issues, too. Of all of us, I am the only one who has succeeded in escaping mental health issues, and have successfully had a work career as well.

I, too, felt humiliated by my husband’s affairs. I felt guilty because I was trained early on that anything that went wrong was my fault. It was hard work to get myself out of that trap, and out of the anger pot, too.

The humiliation belongs to him, not me. He should feel guilty, not me.

In a proper recovery process, the wayward accepts accountability, feels guilty, and shame. The WP apologizes and gives an account of the affair. In our situation, my husband accepts 100%. He is shameful, feels terrible guilt, feels remorse, and has said that he cannot spend a lot of time doing that because the focus in shame and guilt is on himself - and his focus needs to be on me, my needs, my pain, my recovery, and not on himself. He has written a long letter and given me a truthful account of his affairs.

You have a right to feel angry, and it’s normal to be angry after a betrayal.

That boiling pot of lava, though, you know it has to go. It serves you no good. Not in this situation, not anywhere, not ever. It’s something you’re bringing along from that previous life - the one you left behind - and it needs to stay back there, where it can cool and turn to a useless stone and never rise again. Don’t let someone else’s failures take you back down there.

5Decades BW 68 WH 73 Married since 1975

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5Decades ( member #83504) posted at 7:47 PM on Sunday, February 4th, 2024

Oh, one more thing.

There isn’t any "justice" to be had after an affair.

Let that go. It’s vapor.

5Decades BW 68 WH 73 Married since 1975

posts: 163   ·   registered: Jun. 20th, 2023   ·   location: USA
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 Miserylikescompany (original poster member #83993) posted at 4:08 PM on Monday, February 5th, 2024

It feels like you want to fix your vitriol so that it relieves him in some way. As if it’s a burden to him and it’s going to wreck the process. That’s also completely normal.
But, resist that. Again, I think it’s great you are looking at your own healing, but you can’t heal faster out of fear. (And to be honest ws can’t heal faster because of fear either) I would say both of you need to dig into finding compassion with yourselves.

I suppose this is some part of it, obviously I am noticing that after 14 months of non stop crisis and fighting and my feelings being all over the place (mostly not in a good place) and me being severely reactive towards him, he is struggling more and more. And there is always I guess an element of fear that we both, might tire of the process and end up in D due to that.
But mostly, I just want this for me. I feel like I am sabotaging my own recovery. I feel like I'm making my own suffering worse than it has to be. Obviously there is no easy way or quick fix out of this mess as we all know, but there's still I believe, a difference between making it worse for oneself and making it as easy as possible under the shitty circumstances. I'm getting less of what I want in life by being this miserable and angry and bitter. It overshadows the joyful happy personality I've had my entire life and I want to be done with that if possible.


Oh, one more thing.

There isn’t any "justice" to be had after an affair.

Let that go. It’s vapor.

I would love to do that if I knew how? any tips? is there a pill I can take? grin

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Cooley2here ( member #62939) posted at 4:23 PM on Monday, February 5th, 2024

There is such a difference between anger and rage. Anger is of the moment. Rage, as stated above, bubbles under the surface for years sometimes. It is the stage of grief that gets us motivated but can become caustic. What you want is revenge and since you can’t actually physically harm someone you are doing it mentally and emotionally. It’s because you are still grieving. Despair is too painful. It makes you helpless. Anger/rage is a weapon. It gives you a sense of control and hides your grief for short periods of time.

Are you seeing real remorse? Do you feel you are heard? Do you see true changes? The ws never knows the pain they cause. To them, they strayed, they got caught or confessed so why can’t you move on. Until they realize the pain inflicted is as bad psychically as a stab in the back is physically there can not be real healing. Are you seeing that understanding?

If you actually feel stuck use intense therapy but I think physical activity is the best. I have a very active child who never gets angry. She gets all her aggression out in sports. Try to do what you read above and get that rage out. It will eat you up otherwise.

When things go wrong, don’t go with them. Elvis

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SacredSoul33 ( member #83038) posted at 5:24 PM on Monday, February 5th, 2024

It feels like you want to fix your vitriol so that it relieves him in some way. As if it’s a burden to him and it’s going to wreck the process. That’s also completely normal.

But, resist that.

I'm with you if by "vitriol" you mean anger, which is what I suspect. If you mean the actual definition of vitriol, I couldn't disagree more.

cruel and bitter criticism:
"her mother's sudden gush of fury and vitriol"
SIMILAR:
revilement
invective
condemnation
castigation
chastisement

ARCHAIC
LITERARY
sulfuric acid:
"it was as if his words were spraying vitriol on her face"

A BS is not going to get anywhere good by treating the WS poorly because of the horrible things that they did to you. If they're remorseful and working towards healing and making amends, treat them with compassion. Anger is fine. Nastiness isn't.

There is such a difference between anger and rage. Anger is of the moment. Rage, as stated above, bubbles under the surface for years sometimes.

I think of them as exactly the opposite: Rage is a volcanic eruption of pent-up anger. We need to figure out how to deal with anger in a healthy way that doesn't hurt us or anyone else. We need to honor ourselves by acting in ways that don't lead us to regret or shame afterwards.

I'm getting less of what I want in life by being this miserable and angry and bitter. It overshadows the joyful happy personality I've had my entire life and I want to be done with that if possible.

I think you're on the right track. smile

Also, beautifully said, 5Decades. smile

Remove the "I want you to like me" sticker from your forehead and place it on the mirror, where it belongs. ~ Susan Jeffers

Your nervous system will always choose a familiar hell over an unfamiliar heaven.

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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 5:29 PM on Monday, February 5th, 2024

It overshadows the joyful happy personality I've had my entire life and I want to be done with that if possible.

I relate to this deeply- this has been a driving force for me too. It’s very difficult to be so far removed from your normal state of being.
Maybe think of it as getting the poison out so that can happen, a step that you can’t really skip until some of that runs its course. It feels unhealthy but it’s completely healthy and normal to go through the various stages of grief, and they oscillate and are non linear - you have lost something huge in your life.

7 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

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Topic is Sleeping.
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