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Currently the fights is not about the details of the timeline but because I lied about it. again, in my mind, I admited to the worst and the detail did not matter and obviously, that was wrong and I explained it to him but as BS would know, it did not help at all.

When my WH tries to explain why he lied or misled me, things can go sideways quickly. The only why is because he was manipulating me and the situation. I don't want why.

What I want is an acknowledgement of what he did. I want him to own that not only did he fuck up our marriage with his A, but he has continued to do so with his dishonesty and concealment of his thoughts and actions. I need him to show that he understands that it did additional damage and makes trusting him even more difficult.

I need complete honesty now and his silence or any lack of transparency will only confirm my worst fears.

I understand that there is a lot more going on in your relationship, but I wanted to share my experience on this part of your topic. I admire your dedication to trying to finding help.

Currently the fights is not about the details of the timeline but because I lied about it

Can you clarify, was this a new lie? Like new information for him?

Can you clarify, was this a new lie? Like new information for him?

Hmm.... After reading SI and the importance of details, I wrote the timeline with all the details I could remember. Yes there were detail he never had but not new information. Example,😬 AP used condoms, when BH asked where he got the condom from before I said I did not know, the detail was that I did not know where he got it from, either the bedside drawer or if he had it in his pants pocket before he undressed. I realised that the lack of detail let to H to make assumptions and now I need to proof to him that what he made up is not what happend.
I am not sure if this answers your question.

You are taking on an impossible task. There is no way to prove you don't know where the condoms came from. What's the difference anyway?

You are not responsible for your H's thoughts and feelings.

Your H's murder and amputation metaphors say to me that his approach to his healing is to keep you around as a verbal punching bag. You hurt him, and I guess he wants to hurt you back. But that won't heal him. That just adds pain to an already excruciating sitch.

Your H needs help.

IMO, the fact that you make excuses for him mean you can use help, too. If I'm right about what your H is doing, he is harming himself, for you, and any kids who are at home.

If a BS could get "revenge" on the AP - would it have helped with the healing process?

I expended a lot of energy on this, and I concluded I could not hurt ap or my W without adding to my own pain, and I didn't want any more pain.

Revenge is a way of lashing out at others because of the pain one feels, but the pain is inside the person wreaking revenge. The only way to cure the internal pain is to work internally, IMO.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 5:30 PM, Saturday, March 16th]

I am not sure if this answers your question.

It doesn’t. I’m asking when this new information came to his attention. I understand when you made the timeline, but when did this new detail come to his attention - like when did you clarify his assumption. Was it back when you made the timeline or like, recently?

You can do everything exactly, perfectly right post-A, and it may not be enough. Frankly, you can goon up the proceedings after the A with respect to the past, and the BS may be fine. Fact is, the BS has to heal and grow the BS, and you can only impact that so much. You can do your part of standing in the storm you created, and give suggestions. If you are doing those things, then be at peace. You are doing what you can. Your peace and faithfulness will hopefully leak over to him.

I am a BS, and so I know that there is something almost addictive to the pain created by betrayal. The trauma is deep, and there is a way that we can keep picking at it and keep it alive.

I think this is part of what is happening to your spouse. The pain of betrayal has become part of his sense of who he is.

That's not healthy for either of you. The fact that he is still this angry and hurt, 10 years later, means that something that needed to heal is still broken in him.

The best advice I got from this site was to "recover first." I think it is too easy for a BS to agree to reconciliation when they have not even processed the trauma and pain. However, by doing that, creating that space for myself, I had to really ask... do I want to reconcile? Why do I want that? What would it mean to me to learn to live with this?

While 10 years later is a little late, I wonder if this is, in fact, what you both need. If you still want reconciliation, you might have to go back to some missed steps, and that has to be something you are both willing to do. Someone else on this forum said something about this that really stuck with me: there is nothing more intimate than recovering from an affair. Either you are both willing to lean into being flayed open, vulnerable, and raw, or you are not.

As a BS, I had to decide if I wanted this marriage. When I realized I did, I had to learn how to forgive, how to find some compassion, and how to live with this truth about affair recovery: it will never be fair. I still feel lots of feelings about that, but I know it is true. He can do the work going forward to show he can be a safe partner, but there is no 'making up' for the affair. We both have to let that idea go.

Does he want to stay in this marriage? Ask that in an open, neutral way. What would a good marriage look like, now, 10 years later? Can you define what you are moving toward so that you can move beyond that pain?

For us, we BOTH had to accept that the idea of a lifelong commitment we had when we married would have to give way to a new truth. From the day we chose reconciliation (which was about 5-6 months after Dday), we would have to wake up to each day and choose each other. There was no other way forward. That's what we do now.

You made a mistake. It was devastating to your spouse. But that is not all you are. If your BS sees nothing more in you, 10 years later, then you need to calmly and in a place and time where you feel safe and emotionally secure, pose the question: why are we choosing to stay married? Do we still choose that? If so, where are we going so that we have a better marriage?

While I am the BS, not the WS, we are where we are because I was the one who was emotionally intelligent enough in those early days to figure out how to approach him in ways that were not raw with the pain of my betrayal. For me, that was through writing. I could draft and revise until I felt I said what I really wanted to say. If you can't imagine raising this directly, maybe write a letter.

10 years later, you should not be slut-shamed. That's not OK. That's not healed. That's a wound that is infected.

Wise post, RF

Ragab,

As far as revenge goes on AP, tell your BH my story. AP was living in my house having an affair with my wife while I was gone. My son found out about it, and he called out AP. Stood up to him, was disrespectful and a lot of other things. I had no idea as I was across the ocean. AP, while having sex with my wife (as in they were having an PA)also hit my son, and abused him because he didn’t like being called out.

All of this is real, and if anyone deserves vengeance it’s me. However, I’ve done nothing. Because I can’t. If I did what I wanted to do, I’d be in jail for the rest of my life. I’ve settled on that if the zombie apocalypse actually happens I know where my first stop will be, but that is all I will ever get. I have done appropriately legal action but as much as I would love to put AP in the dirt, in reality I can’t do anything. The world isn’t fair. Bad people get rewarded and vengeance often destroys everyone

Okay so it’s been 13 years and 3 years ago you gave him a more detailed timeline that provided more details but not new information. If the examples of where did the condom come from is
An example then I am going to say this probably wasn’t a new dday. And honestly the reason you probably did that 3 years ago was because you were hoping that it would help him heal. It hasn’t. He is no closer today than he was 3 years ago.

So where does that leave you?

You can’t make him get help.
He verbally abuses you which is probably why you haven’t had the strength to leave.
If I told you you have done your time, what would you say? Could you ever leave?

Because honestly I think that’s what it is down to. I know that you feel responsible for his feelings.

We can only be considerate of others feelings. We are not really responsible for them. I have been seeing this theme a lot on here since I have been back on the forum. Boundaries are about where one person ends and another begins and knowing how to effectively navigate with the nuance of knowing when to negotiate, when to compromise, and trying to do this together as a couple. I am going to start a thread in it because I don’t want to detail this one when you are really asking different questions right now, but also because I know there re many here that might benefit from the discussion.